| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
Nathaniel
the far southwest corner of kingdom lands,
Artemisia
93 Posts |
 Posted - 11/24/2008 : 6:41:44 PM
|
With the holidays approaching, my family has started asking me what I would like for a gift this year. I really want to get going with some cut and thrust, but I don't want to end up with unnecessary and/or useless items by doing internet shopping, so I need some advice.
These gloves appear to be similar to the white gloves which Don Isaac uses. Are they adequate protection?
http://www.jackets4bikes.com/Items/g2-black?&caSKU=g2-black&caTitle=BLACK%20LEATHER%20STEEL%20ARMOR%20MOTORCYCLE%20RACE%20GLOVES
quote:
• Protection for the hand
The hand and wrist joints must be adequately protected from impact at all times, to include the fingers, thumb , the metacarpal, and the wrist joint to at least 1 inch above and below the points of the wrist. This protection may consist of a gauntlet constructed from a minimum of 8 oz unhardened leather or equivalent material, or some combination of gauntlet or demi-gauntlet and knuckle bow of a swept hilt basket. The gauntlet should be well secured and not allowed to slip up or down the hand.
It appears that there are significant gaps between the steel plates in that glove. Is the leather in it thick enough to satisfy the protection standards?
The cheapest readily available cut and thrust approved swords appear to be the Hanwei Practical Side Sword. Is that an adequate simulator? Anyone know how their durability is? Are they floppy like the Hanwei Practical Rapier?
Any other suggestions for useful cut and thrust gear would be appreciated.
My thanks in advance,
Nathaniel |
|
|
ceallach
Barony of Bryn Gwlad,
Ansteorra
13 Posts |
|
|
Justin
Loch Salann,
310 Posts |
Posted - 11/26/2008 : 2:27:02 PM
|
Nathaniel, that glove isn't ideal. Take everything I say with a grain of salt, because I'm not currently warranted, but I'd say that you'd need to add some thumb and wrist protection, at a minimum (adding boiled leather or metal plates to those locations would probably be sufficient). I'd also be concerned with the proximal phalanges (3rd bone down, from the fingertip)... depending on what protection is provided by your hilt, you might need more protection there as well. If that is the same glove as Issacs white pair (it sure looks like it), the leather thickness is more than adequate for everything else.
You've seen the Hanwei practical sidesword, thats one of the blades I was passing around during the C&T demo at Collegium. It's quite stiff, just barely SCA rapier legal. It's the most inexpensive C&T blade around, that I'm aware of, and it's adequate. The hilt construction is a little sub-par, the larger arm that passes across the back of the hand likes to snap off.
Ceallach, I'm planning on using the Revival light sparring gloves under my finger gauntlets, but they aren't sufficient by themselves.
|
 |
|
|
Nathaniel
the far southwest corner of kingdom lands,
Artemisia
93 Posts |
Posted - 11/26/2008 : 4:51:22 PM
|
| So Justin, assuming that I get a Hanwei Practical Side Sword, what do you recommend to use for hand/wrist protection? I'd prefer something not as heavy/bulky as full on finger gauntlets, but at the same time, I prefer not to have broken hands. Is there a happy medium somewhere? |
|
|
|
rapierfighter
Barony of Sentinels Keep,
Artemisia
50 Posts |
Posted - 11/26/2008 : 6:51:00 PM
|
Everything below is what I've heard and seen, I'm still getting my equipment and am not authorized to fight or marshal in C&T yet...
Nathaniel, I'm also looking at C&T Equipment and after looking at all the gloves and gauntlets I could find I think I decided on making them myself with good deer hide and abs plastic plates. I haven't gotten there yet, but that's my plan. Some of the C&T's at Estrella were using the heavily padded gloves from Triplette, but I think they had more hand protection from the guard than the Hanwei.
I use the Hanwei Practical C&T blade myself, but I had James make one modification - he changed out the pommel for one 8oz heavier to bring the weight back off the blade to about 1" above the guard. To me, this seems like a good balance and doesn't wrench my wrist when I pull a practice shot.
I'm also picked up some nice steel elbows. They're probably more than I need, but they'll look good and that's half the fun :)
I'm curious to hear what other people are using for body padding as well?
Antoine
|
|
|
|
Nathaniel
the far southwest corner of kingdom lands,
Artemisia
93 Posts |
|
|
ceallach
Barony of Bryn Gwlad,
Ansteorra
13 Posts |
Posted - 11/29/2008 : 5:58:26 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by Justin
Ceallach, I'm planning on using the Revival light sparring gloves under my finger gauntlets, but they aren't sufficient by themselves.
Are you referring to the original "Light sparring gloves" ? http://revival.us/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=189
because this is a newer product that has had reinforcing pads and more padding added. But I haven't seen these new gloves yet. *sigh* |
|
|
|
Justin
Loch Salann,
310 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2008 : 2:54:07 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by Nathaniel
So Justin, assuming that I get a Hanwei Practical Side Sword, what do you recommend to use for hand/wrist protection? I'd prefer something not as heavy/bulky as full on finger gauntlets, but at the same time, I prefer not to have broken hands. Is there a happy medium somewhere?
Not so much. You pretty much need rigid protection for the hand, wrist, and fingers. You can get away with less protection on the hand and fingers if your hilt is complex enough, but the hilt that ships on the Hanwei practical isn't, really. If you had a broadsword or schiavona basket, you get get away with just a demi, but then you've got a bulkier hilt to deal with. Pick your poison. 
quote:
Originally posted by rapierfighter
I'm curious to hear what other people are using for body padding as well?
I'll be going minimum, myself, and I suggest near-minimum for everybody. If we armor up too much, we run the risk of shot calibration ramping up too, which means Society will mandate more protection, which means we up calibration, etc. I'd rather not go down that road. I'll wear minimum, and work hard to help folks keep their calibration right.
Hockey gloves are plenty of protection, but you may find them too bulky - even the street and roller-hockey gloves I've seen are much larger than I'd want to use.
Ceallach, I haven't seen the new Revival kevlar gloves with my own eyes, yet. If I don't get a pair for Christmas, I'll have them shortly after. From looking at pictures of them, I don't think they'll provide enough protection by themselves... if they do, I won't need the finger gauntlets, but I'll hafta see when they arrive. |
|
|
|
Marten
Barony of Arn Hold,
Artemisia
234 Posts |
Posted - 12/01/2008 : 3:53:55 PM
|
quote:
Originally posted by ceallach
quote:
Originally posted by Justin
Ceallach, I'm planning on using the Revival light sparring gloves under my finger gauntlets, but they aren't sufficient by themselves.
Are you referring to the original "Light sparring gloves" ? http://revival.us/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=189
because this is a newer product that has had reinforcing pads and more padding added. But I haven't seen these new gloves yet. *sigh*
I have a gauntlet like this from American Fencers that I got before the days of electric saber to reduce the sting of forearm cuts. It didn't work well with a sport saber. I don't this it will do much for a side sword.
Marten Claessen van den Ruyssevelt
Vox clamantis in deserto
If you understand, things are just as they are...If you do not understand, things are just as they are.
-Zen koan
"Gun fu better than Kung fu." Mizobe Sensei |
|
|
|
Nathaniel
the far southwest corner of kingdom lands,
Artemisia
93 Posts |
|
|
morganwolf
Loch Salann/Arrow's Flight,
Artemisia
228 Posts |
Posted - 12/17/2008 : 02:39:35 AM
|
Bear in mind that 8 oz leather is not really all that rigid, it's pretty much belt leather. Remember, the ounce rating is per square foot, i.e. one square foot of the leather required weighs half a pound.
Barwn Morgan Blaidd Du 'r Chloffa
|
|
|
|
Rodrigo
Arrows' Flight,
Artemisia
55 Posts |
Posted - 12/18/2008 : 5:34:41 PM
|
Nathaniel,
If your gauntlets are pretty much like the ones in the picture, you really should pad them!
If you look closely the finger scales are not heavily curved. So, if you get an "accidental" hit on the finger tips, all of the force will transfer to your tender little fingers. NOT FUN! If they have enough material, I'd suggest a little tweaking with a good hammer to get a little more curve into the finger scales. What will happen is, the scale will contact the handle and give your fingers an "air gap". Fill this gap with a little padding to be extra safe, and they would function nicely and look good too! Now granted, you shouldn't be experiencing the speed and force that the heavies use, but safety is paramount!
The heavies don't refer to fingered gauntlets as "purple finger gauntlets" for nothing.
My .02
Who wants to fight!? |
|
|
|
AaronCarter
Loch Salann,
Artemisia
200 Posts |
Posted - 12/21/2008 : 11:36:17 AM
|
Padding is not required, and in my opinion not necesary for C&T if the gaunts are solid and fit well. (for armoured combat they need to "ground out" but for C&T it's not as important)
look at where the plates land in relation to your nuckles when holding your sword. that should tell you if padding is going to be necesary. |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
|
|
Cut and Thrust armor
